Universal Access To All Knowledge
Home Donate | Store | Blog | FAQ | Jobs | Volunteer Positions | Contact | Bios | Forums | Projects | Terms, Privacy, & Copyright
Search: Advanced Search
Anonymous User (login or join us)
Upload

Reply to this post | Go Back
View Post [edit]

Poster: William Tell Date: Mar 4, 2009 3:51pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Shocking 68 vs 69...

Well, did you think it would be about anything else? So, though I searched high and low (no "flow" though) for instrumentals to satisfy CLIFF (all I think of is that show where they do a slew of 30" versions of songs back to back to back...? when was that?), I have made the following observation:

That's it for the Other One, or just, the Other One (consult JOTS for proper etymology, trust me), I noted that as much as we all love the Fillmore Boxed Set, while listening to TC vs PP, what I noted is that the organ is just a bit more spunky in the Aug, Two from the Vault version than from our beloved Feb/Mar versions of 69. Trust, Jerry et al. may have improved, and NO DOUBT, TC is much better on MotM, and DS, BUT listen to TIFTOO from those two releases (assume everyone has TFTV and FBSet) and I think you have to agree the Aug one has a little more energy and a little more lively interplay between lead (Jerry) and keys (PP) in Aug than it does in Feb/Mar (just listen to what they do in the space between verses in the first sequence when Bob gets started...).

Any thoughts? Should I actually ignore 69 now too?

I will let you all, and JOTS especially, know that I have been really enjoying 71 of late...just can't seem to make it past November of that year...not that any of you really care. But, I like to think you do.

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: Cliff Hucker Date: Mar 4, 2009 4:53pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Shocking 68 vs 69...

Perhaps Southern Comfort had something to do with that?

As the music started to become more complex in late '68, Pig couldnt really keep up. TC had a style that didnt really fit in with much of what the band was doing, with the exception of Dark Star, MOTM, etc...

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: William Tell Date: Mar 4, 2009 7:07pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Shocking 68 vs 69...

Yep; you can't beat him (TC) on MotM, that's for sure. PP remains a mixed bag--the Aug show is almost embarrassing on the DS redundancy, but OOne shines...

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: huntr Date: Mar 4, 2009 4:34pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Shocking 68 vs 69...

Ignoring 69 works for me...

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: William Tell Date: Mar 4, 2009 7:07pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Shocking 68 vs 69...

Smarty pants.

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: light into ashes Date: Mar 5, 2009 1:09am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Shocking 68 vs 69...

Don't agree with you here.
1967 is where to go for Pigpen in full blast and playing lead keyboards. By Aug '68 he was much more restrained (perhaps by the others' request), and I don't think he's doing much in this Other One. There are a few lead lines here & there, but for the most part he keeps quiet and supports the rhythm with a chugging chord. (I suspect the mix on TFTV may have made him too loud.)
The main difference in the Feb '69 Other Ones is that the playing is much 'tougher' - so much so, in fact, that Constanten is pretty much drowned out! But from what I can hear, his counterpoint-lines in Weir's verses are very similar to what Pigpen played - and in the rest of the jam he's much more prominent, actually playing along with Garcia most of the way. (To some extent this makes him sound like an echo of Garcia!) He adds a lot more to the Cryptical section than Pigpen did.
The Cryptical is a lot stronger in '69, but one place where the '68 version wins out is in the ending diminuendo, as they trickle their way into New Potato....this section is really excellent. In '69 they just stumble to a stop.

To hear a keyboard player who really had an influence on the Other One, you'll have to turn to Godchaux....since you've been getting into late '71 lately, you can hear immediately what a huge difference he made in that tune right away in Oct/Nov '71.

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: William Tell Date: Mar 5, 2009 5:27am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Shocking 68 vs 69...

Hey LiA--I think that you have hit the appropriate alternative hypothesis, and in fact, the one that I favor given your comments, and ear (better than mine). My boys and I actually talked about it, and figured TC had to be "better", in a technical sense, and thus, the mix aspect had to be a factor.

So, I think that knowing they all were doing more, and getting better, as much as anything, the overall evolution of the song explains it more than who was playing keys, which I think is your pt.

Nonetheless, I often think that the cliche'd notion of simple is better, or early is when you're energetic, etc., etc., can play a small role...sometimes things get over produced as they develop and evolve and the early ones can be exciting in their raw approache. I think there is a little of that going on too, in addt' to your point.

Hey, speaking of Keith and the fall of 71, what I am impressed with his hearing his piano at the Harding, right? That tinkling is just great on things like the Jam CLIFF was explaining to me yesterday...I know I could search on it, but he generally played a piano, or, if this isn't a lameass way to say it, piano-like organ keyboards...? If that is just totally stupid, I'll come back and delete it, but my point is that in the fall of 71 it seems he sounds very diff in diff shows...was he experimenting with diff keyboards?

Thanks for the input, as always.

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: Styrofoam Cueball Date: Mar 5, 2009 8:31am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Shocking 68 vs 69...

I believe that Harding show is the one where Keith uses 'tack-head' piano for an 'old-timey' sound (Sounds perfect on Cumberland Blues). Unfortunately, it freaks out the sound man who doesn't seem to know how to mix it, so it's distorted some times.

Up until '73, it seems like Keith used organ as well as piano (to great effect on some early "Loser"s and of course on "Here Comes Sunshine"), but over time confined himself to piano only. I think this was part of the band's problem with Keith eventually: too little of a tonal 'palette'...especially when you think of how many different keyboard instruments there are to choose from out there... (should we include accordion, a la Vince? maybe not...) ;-)

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: William Tell Date: Mar 5, 2009 5:02pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Shocking 68 vs 69...

Thanks man! I knew someone would know this...

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: Styrofoam Cueball Date: Mar 5, 2009 11:02pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Shocking 68 vs 69...

It's funny too, because on the GD's studio releases, Keith always played an array of keyboards, including synthesizer (on "Terrapin Flyer")... it's at the live shows where he seemed to just want to play his Grand Piano. Maybe it's easier to hide behind when you nod off than a little Vox Electric Organ like Pig used, lol...

LIA's point is sound (as usual), you can definitely hear a 'falling off' of Pig's keyboard chops in late '68 and beyond... and think about Aoxomoxoa. No Pig tunes at all on it (no Weir tunes either, for that matter), and not much of his keyboard. He looks pretty cool lying next to that violin bow on the back cover though... ;-)

This post was modified by Styrofoam Cueball on 2009-03-06 07:02:55

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: William Tell Date: Mar 6, 2009 5:35am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Aox--what IS up with that?

Yeah, your pt about Aox is an interesting one. The Matrix shows in which they play without PP & Bob seem to span summer thru fall of 68. The apparent "firing" of PP & Bob was in late Sept or Oct of 68, if I recall. Nonetheless, during this period, fall 68 thru spring of 69, they are working steadily toward the Live Dead production, which of course, require PP & Bob...assume they more or less decide that's a "go" by Dec of 68, while still playing Matrix shows without them...?!? Classic Jerry, eh? Going two different directions, incompatible ones at that, it seems.

So, what about Aox--I have struggled mightily with reconciling the different approaches to StSt, in which the Aox version is closest to the June 68 sound I so love. But, near as I can tell, Aox was recorded over a prolonged period, Jan thru Apr of 69 with June release.

Why does StSt come off like the June 68 versions when they were playing the Live Dead version live at the time they were in the studio doing Aox?

And, back to your point, if PP & Bob are "back" by Jan (ie, no more Matrix HBeat shows post Dec...? Right?), why do they play so little/not any role in Aox? Was Aox the equivalent of Jerry's first solo effort in that he just took it upon himself to experiment, play and have fun in the studio knowing the the Live Dead venture would satisfy Warner? Did he think the Anthem experiments in which everyone played had failed because it ended up being over produced? Did he think the simpler approach to songs in Aox was the way to go, and in some sense laid the ground work for Work?

Hmmm, babbling again.

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: Styrofoam Cueball Date: Mar 6, 2009 9:59am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Aox--what IS up with that?

That's not babble, that's thought-provoking. This is one of the most interesting periods in the band's development...when they hadn't really decided what the GD sound WAS yet....now to your excellent points:

I don't think they were really "working up" to "Live/Dead" as early as '68. I think that around the time of "Anthem," they just got in the habit of recording ALL their shows (lucky for us, eh? I wish there were more '67's though). Although fans had been complaining that the first two albums didn't really represent the 'live' sound (despite "Anthem's" cut and paste from live shows), I think the REAL decision to release "Live/Dead" came when they discovered they owed Warner Bros. $250,000 for all the extra studio time they wasted on "Aox." How to get some money coming in without laying out more $$ for more studio time? Live album!! And "Live/Dead" sold so much better than "Aox" it almost worked. Good thing, too, because in those days the Dead weren't that solvent (nor could they charge $150.00 a ticket, like now...and the shows were better, but I digress).

"Aox"... I think, in a way, and certainly not overtly, Jer was 'taking over'. They also recorded a backing track for "Clementine" and the studio "Dark Star" at those sessions...two more Jerry tunes. I think it has to do with Pig's becoming less interested, Bobby being intimidated, but mainly: the arrival of Hunter. He'd co-written "Alligator" of course, but "Aox" was the first "All-Hunter" album, and I think all these new lyrics were inspiring Jer to write more. Weir never seemed that comfortable with Hunter's lyrics (I'm going to put up a thread on the "Hollywood Cantata" debacle soon) and doesn't really write anything again until "American Beauty." Of course, no one would walk up to Pig and say "I'm Taking Over, man." Because those six-guns were probably loaded, y'know?

Both the St. Stephen and Dark Star from these sessions sound like their '68 incarnations, it's true. Maybe they kept them faster and shorter to make sure they fit on the record (doesn't explain "What's Become Of The Baby" though. All bands WERE required to put a long spacey number on their albums in those days... "Spare Chaynge" anyone?), and they may have thought the "Anthem" approach was too murky, as you said. "Aox" although a little sloppily played, is very 'cleanly' produced.

Does it lay the groundwork for "Workingman's?" Lyrically, definitely. "Dupree's Diamond Blues" and "Doin' That Rag" feature Hunter's favorite themes of cards, recycled folk song lyrics, etc, although musically, The band hadn't gotten 'countrified' yet. Since Workingman's material like "High Time" and "Dire Wolf" was already being debuted in '69, one gets the feeling they were quickly moving away from that wonderful fuzzy psychedelia towards the ultra-clean, country-saturated, sound of the 70's. And so an era ended...

Oh yeah, I almost forgot: I HATE MICKEY AND THE F'IN HARTBEATS! whew... ;)


This post was modified by Styrofoam Cueball on 2009-03-06 17:59:33

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: William Tell Date: Mar 6, 2009 10:29am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Aox--what IS up with that?

Ha! RE: hartbeats, I know that others really appreciate the jamming, but to be honest, once was generally enough for me for each of those shows...they just don't grab me either.

As for "working up to LDead," I suppose what I was getting at was by Jan 69 they have settled on the approaches, it seems to me, as in, with StSt (and of course, they even use a couple of tunes from late Jan Avalon shows, right? IE, they pick those to go on the album rather than ones from Feb & Mar). The last of the fall StSt's, near as I can tell, is Dec 29, and then we have more or less the final version in Jan (ie, 4' is now 6', but not the original 6-8' of Jun 68 that was achieved in an AOX fashion). And I think that's when they started carting around the 16 track recording kwip, right?

So, I always figured they were disappointed with Anthem, and decided if they could record EVERYTHING well (ie, 16 track), that would be the way to do it, BUT unlike the "improvisional monster" the lay folks consider them to be, they actually worked their tails off to refine it, thru fall of 68, and then more explicitly in Jan of 69, it was "crystalized" and they kept it largely intact thru the Fillmore shows.

IE, rather than just saying "lets record everything and see if we can make a show of it all" they literally said, "lets perfect the two suites, and record them really well, and we can give that to Warner to get them off our backs, and it is what we do best anyhow" if that subtle difference makes sense to you...

Thanks.

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: Styrofoam Cueball Date: Mar 6, 2009 11:52am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Live/Dead (shall we go)

It makes sense...and I believe you're right. I don't feel the Dead were ever very comfortable making studio albums, hence the time-wasting and goofing off. Even "Wake Of The Flood" wound up being hideously expensive to make (all that money and they still couldn't get a decent drum sound).

I think I just misunderstood what you meant by 'working up to.' Certainly they were perfecting that DS/SS/11 suite and I doubt there were plans to do it in the studio. There is an "Eleven Jam" on the extended "Aox"...but they never added the vocals. "Live/Dead" was obviously the way they wanted that material presented. It seems measly in retrospect (compared to the Box Set of that run), but I'm sure the feeling among Deadheads when it first came out was: At Last!! :)

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: William Tell Date: Mar 6, 2009 12:12pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Live/Dead (shall we go)

Yeah--I really agree about how in retrospect it does seem measly, and shows how when you know everything, much later, it gives you much more insight...

Get this: way back when, in HS, I took a maxell 120' tape and recorded all the songs back to back with no detectable breaks (my friends were nice to me, and said so!), and thought I was ready to be hired by the DEAD as a sound engineer...I wanted to date Betty and figured she'd appreciate my efforts.

I never did hear back from her though.

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: light into ashes Date: Mar 6, 2009 12:49pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Aoxomoxoa vs. Live/Dead

I'd like to date Betty too....

Anyway - I think the most obvious reason that Aox is all-Jerry is because no one else wrote anything. It's true that with Hunter's arrival he could churn out the tunes and crowd everyone else out, but I don't think the others tried either. Pigpen, once Constanten arrived and kicked him off the keyboard in Nov '68, probably felt no need to participate in the studio again (until the band encouraged him a bit more in 1970). Weir was not much of a songwriter at that point, and after being snubbed by the others in Oct '68, probably felt "whatever, man". As for Lesh, it's hard to say - he does get a credit on St Stephen, though - but the band-composed jam-songs like Dark Star and the Eleven went onto Live/Dead instead. (And Clementine, sadly, bit the dust.)
Aox is not that rich in songs anyway - China Cat was an old song at that point, so that leaves only seven newly written songs - and only five of those were regularly done live.

The Dead only started recording their shows again in December '68, and I'd guess more shows from that month were taped and went missing or were taped-over, but we still have a bunch. (Their first 16-track recording was 12-31-68, I believe.)
When they were doing the Anthem shows in early '68, I think they already had an idea of exactly what would go on the album - the same may be true for Live/Dead. I don't think it's a case of "these suites are mature & ready now" - the Dead always saw their music as a continuum, rather than isolated points of time - but they wanted to emphasize the longer jam pieces. Their setlist was pretty small anyway. You'll notice they carefully omitted Aox songs like Mountains from Live/Dead - just as, after '68, they decided not to bother with Dark Star or the Eleven in the studio anymore.
Stephen's the big exception - I don't know why the studio version is so different from the live version, except just for the sake of experimentation. Jerry saw the Aox sessions as a chance to run wild in the studio and play with all kinds of overdubs & recording techniques (as well as a chance to dip his toes into the world of "real songs").

As far as mixing goes, Jerry was much happier with Anthem than he was with Aox. I don't think the Dead were "disappointed" with Anthem at all, they just wanted to move on and do things differently. The band, I think, always remained proud of their work on Anthem, but Jerry was so bugged by Aox he remixed it only a couple years later & deleted the original version!

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: Styrofoam Cueball Date: Mar 6, 2009 6:59pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Aoxomoxoa vs. Live/Dead (for the big gold)

I meant disappointed in the reception "Anthem" got, who wouldn't be proud of the actual product? So I think there was an attempt to 'clean it up' on Aox (the 'world of songs' you mentioned). I can see why Jer wanted to remix it later; they really cluttered up the Aox tracks with extra instruments (in the case of the studio "Dark Star" to the point of ridiculousness...banjo? They just loved tinkering in the studio).

I know what you mean about Aox being a bit light in new material, but since MotM is one of my top 5 fave Dead songs, ever, I never think of the album that way. And the studio "China Cat" is so lovable, with the goofy vocals and insane drum intro, isn't it? It's strange how Workingman's was recorded so much more quickly and simply...and is much more beloved.

And if you dated Betty, you'd get those free organic raspberries too, as a plus... ;-)


This post was modified by Styrofoam Cueball on 2009-03-07 02:59:54

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: whirlwind dreamer 65-95 Date: Mar 6, 2009 1:40pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Aoxomoxoa vs. Live/Dead (for the big gold)

yeah scb!!! the raspberry farm show smokes!!!~ http://www.archive.org/details/gd68-09-02.sbd.miller.22095.sbeok.shnf

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: light into ashes Date: Mar 6, 2009 6:24pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Aoxomoxoa vs. Live/Dead (for the big gold)

The studio Dark Star is interesting, because it comes from Nov '67, when they were just starting recordings for Anthem. Remember by that point, they had probably spent only a few days total in the studio to make demos & their first album.....so that single shows the first time when they were able to spend days & days thinking of new things to put in the music, to the point where much of it is inaudible!
(Among other things, Sgt Pepper came out that summer, which I think had a big effect on recording.)

Versus, the simple & uncluttered Workingman's.....there's a few reasons that happened the way it did. 1) just for a change - the Dead had gone the 'psychedelic mix-for-the-hallucinations' road before, and wanted to do something new. 2) to save money - they were tired of losing thousands of dollars with all that studio time like on the previous albums. 3) the songs called for it - once they decided to do folk/country tunes, the material didn't need much in the way of overdubs or effects.

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: William Tell Date: Mar 6, 2009 1:33pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Aoxomoxoa vs. Live/Dead

Good points, per usual LiA.

I suppose what I was going on was vague notions of having read about the boys being disappointed that Anthem didn't capture the spirit of the Live show, which, I suppose, they did feel finally happened with LDead? Not sure I have it right.

But, I do know you are right about Aox, and that Jerry esp was troubled with the mix, etc. Suppose that at some level, we love them cause they were perfectionists, which seems so counter to the 67 summer of love spirit, etc.

IE, spending huge amts of $$ in the studio to play, hoping to get things "right" but being critical enough to feel you didn't is sort of the essence of these guys, even though it's a jumble of contradictions...

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: dilcurrie Date: Mar 6, 2009 1:40pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Aoxomoxoa vs. Live/Dead

i believe that if the band had known what it would become live then they wouldn't have bothered half as much with the studio, during any period of their career. We all know the songs that were never released as records or released as live only eg Jack Straw.

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: light into ashes Date: Mar 6, 2009 6:35pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Aoxomoxoa vs. Live/Dead

"If the band had known what it would become live...."
But how could they know? Live/Dead was probably seen as being an extravagant step at the time....I don't think by '69 there were a whole lot of live rock albums (let alone double-albums) that showed a whole different band than the studio records. Cream's Wheels of Fire comes to mind, there are probably others, but it was a new field - and the idea of releasing songs only on live albums would be quite novel!
And actually, through the Dead's career, although they were rarely too happy in the studio, they were rarely generous in releasing live albums either. In fact, some of their live releases were thoughtless travesties....more on that later.

As for their rehearsals - yes, they rehearsed intensely, hours a day, in '66-68 - the kind of jam-songs they wanted to do demanded it. The Dec '68 studio session shows in part how much work they put into the Eleven.... (Which is strange if the date is right, since they'd been playing that live for almost a year!) I don't think their shows were ever really 'free-form' in the jazz sense, but they did practice enough to be able to jam freely.
As Jerry said, "You can't play the way the Grateful Dead plays without working at it. It's not something that just happened to us. It didn't happen overnight, either. There was a long, slow process that brought that into being."

As for '69 and later, it's harder to say how much they rehearsed. There is that one great home tape (labeled 12-31-69 in the Archive) with the instrumental Feelin' Groovy & Uncle John, but we don't have many more practice-tapes from the early '70s....there are the early rehearsal tapes with Keith in 1971, which aren't very revealing though, since Keith didn't need much practice!
As for the later '70s - I'll recycle a statement I made in an old thread, responding to someone who thought the Dead didn't rehearse:
"What's with the comment about the Dead's 'well-known aversion to rehearsals'? Maybe that was the case in their burnt-out later days when they were writing hardly any new songs and avoiding the studio, but it's not true of their first decade. Even leaving aside the constant rehearsals of the '60s, this band had spent the whole first half of '75 rehearsing Blues for Allah, another big chunk of time in '77 for Terrapin, plus countless hours practicing for the '76 shows. The Dead could not have sounded like they did without being rehearsal-crazy. But again, those habits probably changed after '77."

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: dilcurrie Date: Mar 7, 2009 2:33am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Aoxomoxoa vs. Live/Dead

Hope this helps, not you personally, but anyone following the thread who's interested:

http://www.archive.org/search.php?query=grateful%20dead%20studio

some good stuff here

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: William Tell Date: Mar 6, 2009 1:54pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Aoxomoxoa vs. Live/Dead

Actually, I disagree. I would pick Workingmans and AmBeauty far and away ahead of all others. Just MHO.

And, the more I have learned of 68, the more I have learned of how hard the practiced, the more I have come to appreciate that they did not really play free form during concerts...the Eleven was perfected in the studio, and they worked really hard at it...without the studio, I don't know what we'd have live...

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: dilcurrie Date: Mar 6, 2009 1:58pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Aoxomoxoa vs. Live/Dead

that is very true, i agree that the practice in the studio payed of live, and that the two albums you mention are beyond compare.

My point is that if they had known how big and good they would become then they wouldnt have brought into the whole top 20 scene, not that they ever really bothered the top 20.

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: William Tell Date: Mar 6, 2009 2:26pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Aoxomoxoa vs. Live/Dead

Ah--got you; esp noted for the sessions in the fall of 65, or with some of the numbers off the first album, though I love em anyway.

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: Styrofoam Cueball Date: Mar 4, 2009 4:43pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Shocking 68 vs 69...

I don't have TFTV, but after what you said, coupled with a review I read where someone was complaining about Pig's keyboard playing on it...I wanna hear it! I do think Pig's organ riffs on TOO (Anthem Of the Sun version) were always awesome and added a lot, interplay with Jerry and all that. Pig's keyboard style was more blues-based than T.C., but that's hardly inappropriate for the material, and it doesn't mean that Pig had no imagination or ideas.

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: William Tell Date: Mar 4, 2009 7:02pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Shocking 68 vs 69...

Hey SCB, if you sample the other Aug shows close to the TFTV date (ie, the 21-22 at FWest and 23 in LA) you should be able to pick it up.

The back and forth is most evident in the pauses between Bob's lines as he sings the first verse, in which PP fills in with a nice little lead in the first pause, Jerry rips it up in the middle, and then PP closes it out as Bob finishes it up. The mix is especially well done for the Vault version, and in later years, Jerry doesn't tackle it as agressively (I always listen for it) and it some, he is "late" or a bit low in the mix or just sort of noodles a few notes. But in the fall of 68 he generally blazes away as soon as Bob gives him an entry point, and the point/counterpoint of Jerry and PP is something even my kids noticed and suggested it must be that TC guy since they didn't think PP could do that...again, PP could surprise you on many levels.

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: Styrofoam Cueball Date: Mar 4, 2009 11:50pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Shocking 68 vs 69...

Thanks for the tip! Always looking for good '67-'68s.. there are so few good recordings out there compared to later years. Of course, we always have the 8 versions of 5/8/77... :)